A few days ago while crawling The Honch, I noticed Geodana’s, a popular “hip-hop” club was closed. Since it’s usually one of the busiest establishments in The Honch, I figured some stupid Sailors got it placed off-limits, but I hadn’t heard or read anything official. Stars and Stripes has an article confirming it was placed off-limits, and that a review board on Yokosuka Naval Base is discussing whether it should be taken off the off-limits list.
From the article:
The club, in the “Honch” entertainment district near the base, was made off-limits to active-duty military on May 23 due to recent incidents involving serving alcohol past a Navy booze curfew and “to overly-intoxicated individuals,” base security officer Lt. Paul Bradley said Monday.
If there’s one reason The Honch has such a bad reputation, it’s because of places like Geodana’s and Club US, another hip-hop club that was on the off-limits list in the past due to brawling and over drunken stupidity. These two clubs are actually permanent Shore Patrol posts. Anytime you walk by either one, there is at least two SP’s standing right outside getting ready to call base security. If it’s gotten to that point, why hasn’t the Navy just put them off-limits completely and make them close down?
I know what some of you are thinking, but this has nothing to do with race. It does, however, have everything to do with the hip-hop attitude and thug mentality many of the patrons of these establishments exhibit. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve walked down The Honch to see shore patrol or CTF70 Shipmates, a.k.a. undercover shore patrol, stop someone who was entering or exiting these places to tell them to take out their earrings or fake “grills.” Then when you’re in these places, you have hip-hop music that encourages violence and being a thug and whatnot, and I know from working out to hip-hop that it has the ability to make you feel like a badass for no apparent reason (maybe it’s just me). Add alcohol to the mix, and the fact that there are about three females around about 50 dudes who all have one thing on their minds, and you have a recipe for trouble. If the base is serious about putting pressure on these types of bars to fall in line with the Navy’s restrictions, then they need to make an example out of the places that cause most of the problems.
Comments 25
First and foremost, there’s a “Navy booze curfew?”
I’m not really sure I understand how the Navy can put restrictions on a club that’s off base, but if it’s actually run by the Navy or something like that, then I agree they need to crack down. If in fact, though, the Navy really has no legitimate say in how the clubs are run, but instead they just ask that the clubs to please respect the rules set forth for the sailors, then they should make the clubs off-limits if they aren’t cooperating.
It’s always disappointing when a few total jackasses ruin the fun for everyone else.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 7:52 am ¶Lynn: Yes, there’s currently a cut-off for public alcohol consumption on the weekdays at midnight, and the weekend at 2AM. This is a typical response from leadership who think nothing bad happens after midnight.
While the Navy doesn’t own the bar, and the bar doesn’t have to listen to the Navy, the bars customer base is almost entirely military. Bars around military bases have no choice but to work with the base, or they’d quickly be out of business.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 8:31 am ¶I have to agree completely with your assessment. First, talk to the owners and explain the situation (as if the past closures haven’t made the message clear enough) and then if things don’t improve, then make it a permanent off-limits establishment.
BTW, I’ve been reading your blog for a while now and greatly enjoy it! I’m a JO who’s been in FDNF for two years now and am about to start two more. Keep up the good work.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 12:26 pm ¶Why should the people who go to those clubs and not get into trouble be punished because of a few people who can’t behave? Why would it be okay to put a club off-limits, yet it’s not okay to have liberty restrictions, etc?
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 12:34 pm ¶They put the club off limits to keep KHK guys from tearing the place apart before they left. It’s going to be much worse when the GW gets here. Much worse.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 3:39 pm ¶Spendthrift: It’s completely different. These clubs have had repeated problems in the past and willfully encourage Sailors to go against the current restrictions the base has given them. This isn’t punishing the Sailors, it’s punishing the establishments that are directly contributing to problems Sailors find themselves in. There are other bars and clubs they can go to and drink or whatever it is they do. The point of my suggestion was to make an example out of bars who don’t work with the current policies, and just continue to put Sailors in positions they may not normally be in.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 3:49 pm ¶Personally I don’t think the Navy should have the restrictions in the first place. All I can think of at the moment to explain my reasoning is a corny analogy typically used to describe relationships, but it works. Basically, if you try to hold sand in your hands, it’s best to hold it loosely with your hands cupped. If you try keep a tight grip on the sand by closing your fist around it, the sand will very quickly slip away. Enforcing a booze curfew is basically like telling everyone, “sorry, we don’t trust you enough to make responsible decisions for yourself, so we’re going to make them for you.” Treat someone like a child, and they will act like a child.
However, as long as the Navy insists on enforcing those rules, I still think it makes the most sense for them to declare the noncompliant clubs off limits if they really want to show them that they mean business.
Now what’s this about it getting worse when the GW pulls in? Please don’t tell me the restrictions apply to spouses.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 6:16 pm ¶Party organizers and party goers all have public networking website accounts and mass e-mail/texting capabilities. These problems will just be translpanted to a different location.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 6:47 pm ¶People will find new spots to meet up, drink past curfew and create problems for each other and Japanese people.
Sadly the Navy has to put restrictions on things like drinking alcohol. If they didnt there would be morons who would come into work completely hammered every day. As if this isnt already happening. It there were no restrictions there would be more trouble because for some reason most sailors dont seem to have common sense. So sadly big brother Navy has to hold there hand and say look here son, cut down on the alcohol consumption and stop being stupid. The Navy is in there full right to restrict there sailors from visiting whatever club they want, we have to give up certain liberties and rights to serve. So i have to listen to whatever Admiral so and so says otherwise i can end up in trouble because i signed a contract saying i will listen and follow all senior leadership. But anyways I agree with Jim Geo’s and Club US should be permanently banned. Those 2 bars and usually Budweisers is where most of the trouble happens out in the honch. I agree its probably because of the mentality overall in the clubs.
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 6:58 pm ¶Put Geodanas and Club US off limits?
You mean people will actually have to leave the HONCH?!
Wow, slow down buddy…scary.
i hate the honch with a passion. I never partied there after my “White Card” time. Taking the 30-45 mintute train ride to Yokohama or Shibuya was worth it. You can drink as much as you want and not worry about SP (not that that’s a good thing, just saying).
These problems will only repeat themselves when the GW gets there. You’ll have a whole new crew of people who are not familiar with all these restrictions and policies. I say the first couple of years will be extremely tumultuous.
Gambatte (good luck) FDNF!!
Posted 03 Jun 2008 at 7:50 pm ¶Who gives a shit? A ton of better places to hang out, enjoy a drink and be with friends with out all the bull shit from wanna be bad asses! Better yet go to the store, buy your Adult Beverages and drink at home.
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 12:26 am ¶So…the clubs should be responsible for ensuring that sailors don’t drink past the curfew? And they should be punished if they serve drinks - or encourage sailors to drink - past the curfew? What happened to treating sailors like adults? This is a constant theme on your blog - treat sailors like adults, no restrictions - and yet in this post you seem more willing to shift blame to the people serving the drinks. ‘Cause, you know, the sailors find themselves in situations they don’t normally find themselves in and…well, golly, anything can happen. If only those nasty clubs wouldn’t serve the alcohol in the first place.
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 2:33 am ¶Treating Sailors like adults is a running theme on my blog, but I don’t think I’ve ever implied that leadership should just let things get completely out of hand for the sake of it. ILPs for instance. While I’ve always been against a blanket ILP policy, I’ve always supported it for junior Sailors who had repeated ARIs or liberty incidents. If something is becoming a problem, something has to be done about it, but that something shouldn’t be a blanket liberty restriction. I’m not sure if you really disagree with the post, of if you’re just trying to show me how I’m being a hypocrite. Would you support putting problem places off-limits, or would you suggest another course of action?
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 2:49 am ¶KJ, I understand all that, but I’m thinking perhaps my sand analogy went over your head. Six years with my husband stateside in the Navy and I’ve never heard of any such restrictions here. Understandably making sure the sailors are on their best behavior in Japan is more of a worry for the Navy than when they are at home, but if the sailors at home are capable of behaving responsibly without booze curfews and off limit clubs, shouldn’t they be given the benefit of the doubt overseas? The more rules there are to break, the easier it is for a normally well behaved person to be considered a trouble maker. Instead of a large group of individuals with a few bad apples, you end up with a whole mess of bad apples.
I still stand my by statement that if you treat someone like a child, they will act like child. You said, “for some reason most sailors don’t seem to have common sense.” Well, there’s your reason.
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 7:35 am ¶For an establishment to be placed on the off-limits list, the Navy doesn’t have to work/talk with them. The Navy has to deem that place unsafe for the well-being of service members. In Virginia Beach, near Oceana, a club was placed on that list because 2 sailors were shot.
It should be common sense that you stop serving alcohol to someone that is intoxicated.
Lynn, the whole reason why the Navy cares more about incidents that happen here is because it becomes an international problem. Appointed officials have to publicly apologize if something happens here and it’s doesn’t help the Navy when especially when the US is trying to work out agreements that isn’t regarded highly by the host nation’s people, like bringing a nuclear aircraft carrier (umm… remember we dropped a couple of nuclear bombs on Japan).
Also, policies can affect spouses/dependents if you are SOFA sponsored and if that policy covers SOFA status personnel. Just like in Okinawa, the commander down there placed a restriction on military and SOFA status personnel which affected civilians also. So that drinking policy could apply to you, if it included SOFA status personnel.
Some sailors need to be treated like children because they don’t know how to act like adults. I’m sure everyone here that has been in or still serving can tell you a story of a shipwreck. You practically have to hold their hand to get something done, whether it’s something related to personal hygiene or getting work done.
But regarding the OP, if those places continue to promote unsafe activities, I think they should stay on the list. If they are actually trying to change then a 2nd (if it’s their 1st time being on the list) chance should be given. You shouldn’t ban a place just because they play a type of music or the type of patrons they service.
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 4:07 pm ¶Okay.
If there’s truly dangerous criminal activity being condoned or actively promoted in a club, then I think it should be off-limits, though that goes against my civil libertarian principles. I do agree that there are places in which contact between some real bad actors (non-Navy) and navy people will most likely result in tragedy of some kind or another. And quite frankly people seeking out that kind of place to have fun shouldn’t be in the Navy.
But when you couch it in terms of ‘over-serving’…it really does imply a shift of blame from the person doing the drinking to the person selling the booze. If we went around placing every bar in which somebody got shit-faced & then belligerent off limits, it’d be a longer list. And I don’t think that the clubs are the primary guilty party.
I understand the rationale behind putting a club off-limits when there’ve been fights. But it totally pisses me off that it should be necessary. And the idea that we have to put a club off-limits to prevent sailors from getting in trouble there directly contradicts the argument that if we treat sailors like adults they’ll behave professionally and won’t get in trouble. Any of these restrictions…they’re points on the same continuum. That’s where I think you contradict yourself, Jim - though I don’t think you’re a hypocrite. Try to pin down exactly where the ‘good’ restrictions end and the ‘bad’ restrictions start, and you’ll find yourself lost in the gray areas, which unfortunately is where a lot of people are wandering around as we speak.
Oh, and in the opening paragraph - when I talk about ‘criminal’ I am kind of fencing off my definition to suit myself - I don’t mean UCMJ, I mean the local criminal code. So I don’t define ‘drinking after midnight’ as a ‘crime’. I see that as a ‘violation of Navy policy’. Yeah, yeah, try arguing that at mast but whatever.
Posted 04 Jun 2008 at 11:33 pm ¶Both those places are shitholes anyways. I’ve had to deal with instructing young sailors to take out their earrings and “grills”. On a couple of occasions, on the shipmate watch and after displaying my ID card, I was told to “fuck off cracker” and also had to restrain a sailor after he placed his hands on me. Why these kids think they can act like this a 1/4 mile from the main gate is beyond me. I agree with D-San that the GW is going to do a number on Yoko when it gets there. As much training and briefs that have been done with that crew already, it is just inevitable. Hopefully, the sailors that crossdeck onto GW really give some warning and training to their new shipmates. Stand by for heavy rolls.
Posted 05 Jun 2008 at 12:03 am ¶Considering a few of the stories I have been hearing about how some of the GW people are acting in San Diego, I have to agree things probably will get a lot worse for you Yokosuka people. As I said before, I understand why restrictions are more important in Japan, but when I said the sailors should be given the benefit of the doubt, I forget who the hell I was talking about. Scratch that bit about sailors being capable of responsible behavior at home because I totally forgot about how many times my husband has had to accompany people to court or bail them out of jail. One kid still owes us $100 from when my husband bailed him out for a DUI shortly before the GW left Norfolk. Forgive my momentary idealistic views. Such a shame when the few ruin it for the masses.
By the way, what is SOFA sponsorship?
Posted 05 Jun 2008 at 8:33 pm ¶SOFA by GlobalSecurity.org
I guess the correct term would have to be Command sponsored. But then we would be considered SOFA status personnel.
PSD Yokosuka Command Sponsorship
If you aren’t command sponsored then you would be considered a tourist here and you can’t stay in the country longer than 90 days even if you arrive in the country with your spouse that’s here on official orders.
Posted 06 Jun 2008 at 1:00 am ¶As of today, 06 JUNE 08, Geodana’s has been removed from the off-limits list. This was due to Geodana’s hiring security guards to prevent over intoxication, and agreeing to follow the alcohol restrictions. Let’s see how long this lasts.
Posted 06 Jun 2008 at 1:24 am ¶Oh by the way, for anyone out there who may be bringing Japanese friends/sig others on base, in order to be able to use the Japanese driver’s license as a form of ID, the person’s address needs to be in English (its the second space from the top on the license I guess) or they will not accept as a valid photo ID. Otherwise you have to use a Japanese passport…which, uh, is mostly in Japanese except for the passport holder’s name. Yeah. I sorta flipped out about that since the security guy said (and this was the first time I heard about it…I don’t live on base so I don’t watch channel 12, I don’t listen to Eagle 810 and I don’t read the Sea”Weed” either other than to see how many photos of CAPT Weed had put in the paper) he wouldn’t help me at all about this. Yeah. So either your Japanese friends have to carry thier passport or pay more money to get thier license changed. FYI.
Posted 08 Jun 2008 at 4:04 pm ¶Oh yeah, GW is going to…yeah…from the base where you can get robbed waiting to get on base in the morning, or get robbed at the Food Lion that’s near the base or the BK near the base…when the best idea is to drive as fast as you can down Hampton Blvd with your doors locked and windows up until you hit Ghent…yeah. And that’s not forgetting that you car is likely get broken into at the carrier lot over there by the carrier piers onbase. Glad I had a POS as a daily driver when I was stationed there…
Posted 08 Jun 2008 at 4:08 pm ¶After spending six years in Japan I’ve experienced a lot of things that can be changed about the honch. Banning clubs is not one of them like others say they will find another place to go. At least in the honch you have a leash on the ones who get out of hand. Having them spread out into places like Yokohama and Shibuya is not only making it worst but then you have all sorts of problems to fix once conflicts errupt. Those club owners have a business to run banning their clubs hurts them and the patrons who attend those clubs go elsewhere. To places that dont have shore patrol standing outside waiting to get the rule breakers off the street!!!
Posted 02 Jul 2008 at 10:29 am ¶First off Jim, most of your posts are dead-on. You barely skimmed the surface with your “7 things I hate about Yokosuka” (no pun intended), but come on now. If you took a walk down the honch, you’d realize that they have to find a bar that caters to each person’s type. I personally prefer hip hop music, but I hate the trash they play in both US and Geo’s. I sure as hell would never go into George’s, that place simply isn’t for me. The point i’m trying to make, is that this place is more or less a melting pot. Anywhere in the Navy, you’ll have different people from different places who have different tastes. And as sailors, we ALL need an outlet to vent some steam. And I know that I’d rather go somewhere that they play some semblance of the music I like. I can’t speak for the youngins that go in there and cause trouble. Like I said before, different people from different places. Don’t blame the music, blame the environment. We can’t all choose where we grew up. And yes, shore patrol is a hassle, and eventually, if not already, people are gonna start fuckin shit up in Tokyo, also. So then it becomes, do we need shore patrol in Shibuya, Roppongi and Yokohama too? Or will they realize that they’ve gone overboard and tone down shore patrol in Yokosuka, which is highly unlikely. Sailors will be Sailors, whether they love the Navy or not. And I fully intend on NOT being in the honch when the G.W. get here.
Posted 21 Jul 2008 at 8:38 pm ¶the drinking curfew is bullshit… but since there is one we have to follow it… we are all adults and it shouldn’t be up to the bars to not serve the sailor it should be up to the sailor the follows the rules. my outlook for when the GW gets here the base will be locked down all the ships will be underway way and the GW sailors will fuck it up.
Posted 14 Aug 2008 at 5:54 am ¶Post a Comment
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